This NOT a comment about the forum administration or requirements for usage.
About the theme of your poem Dennis.
I think the issue is an important one for our society. Differences in societies have always caused people to cavil, I think we are ever tribal and only easily approve what belongs to our tribe.
Our society is in the grip of post-modernist thinking which teaches that truth is not in the message but is created by the hearer of the message, and what the hearer decides that the message might mean is what the hearer approves or disappoves, despite what the messenger claims to be saying. Therefore, sadly, in our society, " offence" has become the proof positive of disorderly words or actions.
I think that, in our society, " offence" has certainly become a tool to impose censureship. That is not to say that offensiveness is not a real issue at times. It's the slippery definition of offence that is the problem, I think.
You Can't Say That!
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Neville Briggs
- Posts: 6946
- Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 12:08 pm
- Location: Here
Re: You Can't Say That!
Neville
" Prose is description, poetry is presence " Les Murray.
" Prose is description, poetry is presence " Les Murray.
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Dennis N O'Brien
Re: You Can't Say That!
Marty:
Okay....I think Henry Lawson may have stopped spinning in his grave.(or at least slowed)
I didn't see your comment by the way, so yeah you'll have to take my word for it.
The swear word I saw in the mentioned comment was sh*t (maybe I missed something)
I have to admit you would never see such an obscenity on Facebook.
I put Fa*t in a poem the other day because it was appropriate I thought,
and "passed wind" would have played merry hell with my metre.
Good to hear that satirical/political/social comment poems are welcome.
They are bound to attract comments for and against and some people will take them
completely the wrong way (as compared with what the poet intended) - sh*t happens.
Anyone who looks through my poems will find they are a small proportion of what I post.
Is my inoffensive poem now going to be put back on the open forum?
Cheers Dennis
Okay....I think Henry Lawson may have stopped spinning in his grave.(or at least slowed)
I didn't see your comment by the way, so yeah you'll have to take my word for it.
The swear word I saw in the mentioned comment was sh*t (maybe I missed something)
I have to admit you would never see such an obscenity on Facebook.
I put Fa*t in a poem the other day because it was appropriate I thought,
and "passed wind" would have played merry hell with my metre.
Good to hear that satirical/political/social comment poems are welcome.
They are bound to attract comments for and against and some people will take them
completely the wrong way (as compared with what the poet intended) - sh*t happens.
Anyone who looks through my poems will find they are a small proportion of what I post.
Is my inoffensive poem now going to be put back on the open forum?
Cheers Dennis
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Dennis N O'Brien
Re: You Can't Say That!
Neville:
Yes personally I'm not offended by anyone expressing an opinion even though it may differ
greatly from my own. I sometimes write poems about beliefs that aren't my own.
For instance I write some religious poetry although I am not a practicing Christian and
by some definitions not a Christian at all.
You are right that the notion of offense is being used to try to censor views not held by those in
power and vested interests. An example would be the left's attempts to shut down the debate
on Anthropogenic Global Warming or the present government's attempts to "rein in" the newspapers
who are not being kind to them.
I would encourage people to write poems that counter any perceived arguments that
my poems convey. I think it is naive to expect poets to not write poetry that touches on
the various major or minor "issues" that are circulating amongst the population these days.
Invariably there will be positive and negative reactions to such poetry which could be construed
as a separate debate but it will have emanated from the poem itself and is therefore in
my view legitimate. The important thing here is free speech - something that in the past men
have fought for and died for. I think were they here now that they would be somewhat surprised that
we are having this argument.
Cheers
Dennis
Yes personally I'm not offended by anyone expressing an opinion even though it may differ
greatly from my own. I sometimes write poems about beliefs that aren't my own.
For instance I write some religious poetry although I am not a practicing Christian and
by some definitions not a Christian at all.
You are right that the notion of offense is being used to try to censor views not held by those in
power and vested interests. An example would be the left's attempts to shut down the debate
on Anthropogenic Global Warming or the present government's attempts to "rein in" the newspapers
who are not being kind to them.
I would encourage people to write poems that counter any perceived arguments that
my poems convey. I think it is naive to expect poets to not write poetry that touches on
the various major or minor "issues" that are circulating amongst the population these days.
Invariably there will be positive and negative reactions to such poetry which could be construed
as a separate debate but it will have emanated from the poem itself and is therefore in
my view legitimate. The important thing here is free speech - something that in the past men
have fought for and died for. I think were they here now that they would be somewhat surprised that
we are having this argument.
Cheers
Dennis
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Heather
Re: You Can't Say That!
Quick! You've got 5 minutes to read this poem before it moves again! 
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Vic Jefferies
- Posts: 1041
- Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2010 8:21 am
Re: You Can't Say That!
I too seemed to have missed something. I was merely stating that I liked Dennis' poem and agreed with his point of view which is (as I understand it)the freedom of speech we talk about is now dependent upon us toeing the line and being politically correct. My comments are meant to be read in context with the poem and I have not suggested for a moment that we turn this forum into an "all in" discussion group. I just hope more people write similar poems containing social comment.
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Dennis N O'Brien
Re: You Can't Say That!
Yes I hope so too Vic and maybe some disagreeing strongly with
the content of my poem. After all I'm a great believer in free expression.
With regard to the general discussion about comments on a poem's content: I think
this is bound to happen and can develop into what looks like something unrelated to the original
poem. As long as the discussion references the poem I can't see the problem.
A poem is not necessarily just a collection of pretty rhyming metered lines about innocuous subjects,
(alright a lot of mine are - well maybe not the "pretty" bit )
but may be a work conveying social comment, an idea, a philosophical point of view, history - the list goes on.
Naturally the topic of the poem as well as its form may generate discussion and where the topic is
political or address's certain social conventions in perhaps a satirical or what some may think of as a disrespectful way
there will be differences of opinion. I think this is to be expected.
Well here there may be differences of opinion but I would suggest that in many poetry circles everyone would be in perfect agreement.
(Oh and in those circles I'd be out on my [rear end] in 5 minutes flat ).
the content of my poem. After all I'm a great believer in free expression.
With regard to the general discussion about comments on a poem's content: I think
this is bound to happen and can develop into what looks like something unrelated to the original
poem. As long as the discussion references the poem I can't see the problem.
A poem is not necessarily just a collection of pretty rhyming metered lines about innocuous subjects,
(alright a lot of mine are - well maybe not the "pretty" bit
)but may be a work conveying social comment, an idea, a philosophical point of view, history - the list goes on.
Naturally the topic of the poem as well as its form may generate discussion and where the topic is
political or address's certain social conventions in perhaps a satirical or what some may think of as a disrespectful way
there will be differences of opinion. I think this is to be expected.
Well here there may be differences of opinion but I would suggest that in many poetry circles everyone would be in perfect agreement.
(Oh and in those circles I'd be out on my [rear end] in 5 minutes flat
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keats
- Posts: 1044
- Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 11:43 pm
Re: You Can't Say That!
I ate a whole Pizza with Ray Essery tonight. But it's all relative.
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manfredvijars
Re: You Can't Say That!
How big a hole did you eat in it??
IS RAY ESSERY YOUR FATHER???
IS RAY ESSERY YOUR FATHER???