The A.B.P.A. needs to move ahead.

[Stephen Whiteside]

Well, you say competitions are not working for the ABPA, are using up resources and benefiting very few, which seems to be coming pretty close to suggesting they are damaging. Anyway, I guess that's just semantics.

My experience would suggest that 'stand alone' poetry festivals struggle to attract large numbers. Tacking poetry events onto music festivals - as happens widely now - is a tried and true strategy.

One thought that springs to mind is that a poetry festival that combined 'bush verse' with 'free verse' could be very interesting, though I doubt if anybody would be able to get the free verse fraternity to cooperate.

[manfredvijars]

... So, let's just stick with the "same ol, same ol"? ....

[william williams]

there is a question that is here. It is the details in the costing's about the financial cost of a state championship. $10,000 to $20,000


bill williams

[Robyn]

One thought that springs to mind is that a poetry festival that combined 'bush verse' with 'free verse' could be very interesting, though I doubt if anybody would be able to get the free verse fraternity to cooperate.

It is possible to bring the two together on a small scale - in Binalong we run an open mike event called A Brush with Poetry every second month, and because we have an organiser in each camp we tend to get both free verse and bush poets, as well as (often) musicians. It makes for a really lively and interesting afternoon, and I think helps all camps appreciate the other's work.
No doubt this will run its course eventually, but for the past year it has been great.
Don't know that it would work on a larger scale, but you never know.

[Stephen Whiteside]

Yes, that's interesting. There's always been a slight difference between the 'folk festivals' and 'country music festivals' in this regard. There is a steady trickle of free verse at the Poets' Breakfasts of the folk festivals, but almost none at most of the country music festivals.

Do nothing, Manfred? I would personally be reluctant to attempt any radical changes. I don't think things are going too badly, all things considered. We have an elderly demographic, and we probably aren't recruiting many younger members, but there is a certain inevitability about all of that, I suspect. Fiddling too much with the basic formula could very easily make things worse rather than better.

[manfredvijars]

I wouldn't sweat it Stephen, doing nothing is par for the course.
Within our ageing demographic, more tasks are put on fewer people who are - ageing and getting tired ...

Yes William, $12,000 to $20,000 ...

[Stephen Whiteside]

Not sweating it, just trying to make a contribution to the discussion.

I don't think tiredness and age should be a huge problem. Nobody should feel they are indispensable or try to be a martyr. If people are feeling exhausted, they should walk away. If younger people are prepared to pick up the mantle, well and good. If not, then there will probably be problems.

People struggling on nobly in spite of burnout is often the worst thing that can happen to an organisation. Often a good crisis is exactly what is needed to galvanise people into action. Of course, the risk is that it won't, but the risk is still worth taking.

[william williams]

Manfred I may not have worded my question correctly what are the costs incurred that bring about the cost of the state comps

bill williams

[Peely]

An Illustration of championships costs for you Bill

The Queenswales ABPA Open Bush Poetry Championship (we'll make it a fictional State Championships)

4 sections each, men’s and women’s

1st $150
2nd $100
3rd $50
Total
$300

8 x 300 = $2400

Add a Yarnspinning section, same spread of prize money (no separation of men and women)

$300

Total = $2700

Add a Novice Section (for argument sake, no separation of men and women, same prize structure)

$300

Total = $3000

Written Sections (Humorous and Serious, for argument sake we will keep the same prize structure)

2 x $300 = $600

Total = $3600

Perhaps we’ll add a novice written (make it just a single section for argument sake, same prize structure)

$300

Total = $3900

Champion prizes (Men’s and Women’s)

Champion $200
Runner-up $100
Total
$300

2 x $300 = $600
Total = $4500

That is $4500 without paying for judges

Performance Competition Judging (for argument sake, we’ll say 4 judges on a rotation during the competition)

4 x $400 (probably at the bottom end of payments)

$1600

Total = $6100

Written Judge

$400 (again probably bottom end)

Total = $6500

Compere for competition

$500 (again probably a bottom end cost)

Total = $7000

That is $7000 just to run an adult competition

Additionally, trophies and medallions could also create additional costs. Venue hire may need to be considered. On top of that you might also want to add junior competitions for written and performance as well. Costs of promotion and advertising need to be factored in too. With those on top of the other prizes and judging, you are well on your way to the $10000 figure

[william williams]

Yes John I agree that the costs areas are as you put them They are definite approx costs but you have not included the deductions of entry fees for these comps at $5.00 to $10.00 and may be 100 to 200 plus entries in each written section

Yarn spinners $5.00 may be 40 to 50 entries

up to 25 performers sections (3) of them $5.00 per section

novice and juniors are generally free

What about those donations and sponsors don't they count also often people are charged a donation of $5.00 to $10.00 a head at the poets breakfast to hear the results of the competition and hear the final best 10 performers to be judged.
These are costs and incomes that cannot be ignored.

Bill Williams