Are old things holding us back.

[Neville Briggs]

Marty Boyce made a comment about old things holding us back. So I posed the question to myself, is bush poetry too much concerned with old stories, old people, old themes and so forth , to its detriment.

It's a complicated question because I believe that all material is fit for for poetry, even far back " out of date " stuff. And surely bush poetry is a vehicle for relating to our historical development. Even the modern poet Les Murray wrote a ballad about Jimmy Governor.

Is it a question of balance, does bush poetry relate so much to the past and so little to the present. I don't know, there are plenty of performers I hear at the bush poetry venues who do contemporary themes in bush poetry. But in the wirtten competition entries that are published as winners there does seem to be a large proportion of themes relating to the past. Is that bad ?

Or maybe it is a question of language. Is it the case that the bush poets are speaking with the voice of a bygone era and not with a voice that is familiar to the contemporary ear.
In the performances, Greg North, Murray Hartin, Neil McArthur et al seem to be able to relate bush poetry to contemporary audiences with contemporary speech, should we take a cue from them?
Is it the writing, have we failed to put in the work of listening to contemporary speech and speak that in bush poetry writing? Some of the written stuff that I see in bush poetry doesn't look anything like the speech that I hear on Q&A

Should bush poetry sound like everyday speech, maybe it should sound " poetic "
maybe "poetic " is bound to sound old fashioned to the untrained ear.

These are my rambling thoughts.

What's the answer Perhaps there is nothing at all wrong with the style and content of the bush poetry..

I know what I think, but maybe I am wrong so I'll reserve my opinion.

[Stephen Whiteside]

Say what you think, Neville. If anything is holding us back, it is people lacking the courage of their convictions - and I put myself forward here as number one culprit.

[Zondrae]

My bit,

About 95% of the poetry I recite is my original work. (The other 5% I have learned for competition purposes only) I have not (yet) written about bush rangers but have tackled drought, storm, mining, just skipped by horses, dogs and children. I write about the things I know. I write about my feelings and ideas on many topics. I try to stay away from politics and yet I look for chances to talk about religion (one of the things we were told as children you never speak about in polite company) and I have talked about my operaton.
I am proud of the fact that I make the effort to write with Rhyme and metre, even if the literati look down their noses at me. When I started writing I said," but I don't write about the bush so I' m not a bust poet". I have since learned better. I write and recite for my own pleasure and satisfaction. If I entertain some other people along the way, that's good - if not, I'd be a bit disappointed - in a packed venue (say 350) I hope at least half, (possibly the women,) will connect with my poems.
As for trying to write for the 'masses' - who was it said 'you can please some of the people some of the time, or some of the people most of the time, or most of the people some of the time but you'll never please all of the people all of the time'. 'Whoever it was, was a wise boy.

In the meantime I'll keep doing what I do and hope for the best.

[keats]

Not even sure this makes sense but in a nutshell while holding onto old traditions and keeping that flame alight we also have the opportunity to make new ones

Oh no, Marty, that makes perfect sense. Take a look at Murray Hartin's latest poem on Black Caviar. Been on radio twice today and TV once. Will also be doing it live on Sunrise tomorrow from Randwick. A modern theme which is a better and more passionate piece of poetry and more Australian than much I have read recently, which is why Muz (to me, Australia's most clever writer) continues to be at the forefront of taking Aussie Poetry to the masses and to hundreds of thousands of people who are uninitiated in modern Aussie rhyming poetry. How does he do it? He gets out there and takes it to the people. Those who simply write and enter our Poetry comps are really only preaching to the already initiated, which, let's face it, is a very small section of our society.

If we stay with days of old, we are only attempting to put a modern spin on days we did not know about first hand. Personally I never knew any bushrangers and if I wish to read about them I will consult an old poem or a history book, not a modern day poem. Sure, if someone is living on the land and writing of experiences they know, then fine, but why try to write of the Eureka Stockade or Anzac Cove? They have been written about in the past by those who were either there or alive at the time.

Audiences are highly intelligent ad can distinguish between a historical lesson and something that directly connects them to something they know and are familiar with in their own lifetime. Sure, Comedy performances attract the bulk of the crowd's attention, not to say it is the technically correct approach, but numbers don't lie. Poet groups such as The Naked Poets have done more for increasing crowds and bringing people to our shows, than any form of Competition we have ever run. Most Poetry Comps these days attract little more than the same old (and small) crowds, other than the poets and their partners.

Just my thoughts, but if we want to take our art to bigger audiences, we need to, IMHO, to give them subjects that are fresh, vibrant and relevant.

Neil McArthur

[Peely]

Sometimes you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. A while back now, I wrote a poem about a bushranger in first person from his perspective, using contemporary language (the opposite approach to what Baz Luhrmann did with "Romeo and Juliet"). I tried this as a fresh approach to an old theme, only to find myself criticised for not using the language of the time. The problem that I saw with using old language was that if I went into a school to perform the poem, I would want my audience to understand it and I felt that older language would make this harder. It is not a poem that I have performed though, the criticism came out of a writing workshop. I thought this poem had potential, I might dig it up and tidy it up.

And I can say that whilst it is nice to revisit the past from time to time in your writing, I think it is better to focus on modern times.

[Bob Pacey]

Well I'm old and I ain't holding anyone back !


Robert

[David Campbell]

We covered this general area pretty thoroughly in May last year (13 pages!), so I won’t repeat what I said there except to say that yes, it’s a matter of balance. Those who enjoy writing about the old themes should continue to do so, but we also need a strong representation from those who continually push the boundaries with contemporary issues and language.

However, I do want to take up Neville’s comment about written competitions, in which there seem to be a large proportion of themes relating to the past. The problem here is that the natural tendency is to 'play safe' in the hope of winning a prize. There are some competitions that seem to frown on anything that relates to the current era. It takes time to identify them, but I assume I’m not alone in figuring out that it’s probably a waste of time (and money) deviating from the old ways when entering some comps. You’ve only got to read the winning poems year after year to see what they’re after, and so people tend to go along with that. Thus it becomes a bit of a vicious circle. The competition is unlikely to change in those circumstances. Like John, I don’t mind looking backwards on occasions, but I think it is better to "...focus on modern times."

The only other choice is to ignore those competitions and concentrate on those with a more flexible attitude, and it’s been good to see that several have developed considerably in this regard in recent years. Writing about the past is rewarding if you can find a new approach or an original story (and some poets are very good at this), but it’s becoming increasingly difficult to be original. So many poems I see as a judge go over the same historical ground that has been covered time and time again…often in the same competition.

I was at an award ceremony last night, and there were quite a few young people there to receive prizes. In the children's poetry section the judge commented that submissions were in free verse or “carefully rhymed” (encouraging!), and that common themes were war, nature, the environment, and relationships. She was critical, however, of “…too many long, detailed examples of rejection and loneliness.”

Young people are, quite naturally, writing about what affects them here and now, and we need to keep this in mind if we want to keep them interested in bush poetry. If they want to delve into history, that’s fine, but we can’t expect them to do this, or insist on it…chances are they’ll simply lose interest. They need to see us oldies also tackling themes that resonate with them, issues in the headlines and on TV. In language they understand. As Neil says, we need to give them subjects that are "...fresh, vibrant and relevant."

I’ve commented elsewhere about “sounding poetic”. The challenge is to use a combination of everyday words in such a way that striking imagery conveys a memorable impression to the reader…while following the rules of metre and rhyme. It’s an endlessly fascinating journey!

Cheers
David

[Leonie]

Those who simply write and enter our Poetry comps are really only preaching to the already initiated, which, let's face it, is a very small section of our society.

Most Poetry Comps these days attract little more than the same old (and small) crowds, other than the poets and their partners.

Uumh, while I have to agree with this (up to a point) I sense a change is in the wind. These last twelve months have been the most successful ever for me in comps and I almost never write about the distant past, or the bush either for that matter.

I actually picked up a first in the recent Tenterfield Oracles of the Bush comp for 'Voices', that poem - , the one that caused such a stir when it was granted a HC in the Bronze Swagman a couple of years ago. So while there is still resistance on the comp scene ... 'the times they are a-changing'

[Heather]

Congratulations Leonie! I'm very pleased for you.

Heather

[keats]

We covered this general area pretty thoroughly in May last year (13 pages!)

So true, David. Seems to rear it's head every twelve months, with no resolution.

Cheers

Neil